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You've given me the only laughs I've had for over a week. You put this mess into perspective by satirizing it. Don't apologize for that.

What that handful of criminals did was abhorent and immoral, but I don't think it holds a candle to the disgusting, immoral, and in my opinion, treasonous propaganda coup handed to the enemy by the media and politicians who think nothing of climbing atop the bodies of those who are fighting just so they can tar ALL Americans with the same crime. (Wave to the cameras, fellas!) I'm sick to death of the dangerous way this war is being fought in this country (*just like it was during Vietnam*). I'm sick to death of those people who give evil a pass, unless they are speaking of America. I'm sick to death of those who are possessed of such an adolescent self-centeredness that they worry themselves sick over what others may think of them. (Russia said that Germany told him that France said that Iraq thinks you're too fat.) In case you've missed it, the enemy hates you no matter what you do; enemies like Sheikh Omar Bakri Mohammad of London, who said, "We don't make a distinction between civilians and non-civilians, innocents and non-innocents. Only between Muslims and unbelievers. And the life of an unbeliever has not value. It has no sanctity." Yep, let us turn the other cheek to that and see what we earn for our trouble. Mr. Berg, are you listening?

You cannot dehumanize someone who has given up their humanity. By his own words, Sheikh Mohammad and all the rest like him, have shown themselves removed from civilized, human society. We treat them humanly because WE are human, not because they are.

I humbly beg everyone's pardon for the rant -- but I do feel ever so much better. McMuffins set me off with his "dehumanizing" comment.

I thank Greyhawk for providing this outlet, and, for the sake of my own sanity (as though you care about some anonymous, ranting female), I beg him, PLEASE don't spare a word.


Tongue Boy

I do not accept your apology because it absolutely was not frickin' necessary. Keep up the righteous satire, my man.


Your satire is fine with me, and I agree that this is being way overblown, and it will be a huge setback if we keep saying it will ad nauseum and keep wringing our hands about it.

Saddam's ex-torturers must be laughing their heads off to see us so pilloried for much milder stuff than they practiced daily, with very little publicity.


Yes, it was satirically funny. And anyone who didn't think it was needs to GTF over it.


While I usually enjoy your work, I thought that your post about this incident was objectionable for the reasons that you eloquently state. I salute your follow-up comments.

Roger Glass

I also admire the bloggers who criticized your article, but in this instance I don't agree with them. There's a difference between using the mistreatment as a basis for your satire, and approving of the mistreatment itself. You did indeed base your satire on the mistreatment, but you obviously didn't condone it. I think your detractors are failing to see this distinction.

I do think you accomplished your objective. You don't owe any apologies.

mr mcmuffin

I think I am one of those 'anti-war leftists' that spoons so eloquently talks about above. I think the whole thing is wrong. But, I am not a fool, I understand that when soldiers go to war, the only way in which they are able to kill other people is to develop a capacity to dehumanise them in some way. This is not something you can turn on and off with a flick of a switch. It is also not very selective, the end result is that everyone is dehumanised, friend and foe alike. It is just one of the many ways in which we pay for sending people to kill other people.

R. Shackleford

It's all a Bolshevik plot to Trotskyize us!


I don't believe that our image has taken a hit in the eyes of the average Iraqi, especially if the investigation and punishment for the dumbshits who did these things is public and expedient. As for the the much vaunted "Arab Street", they already hate the great Satan for being ourselves and this did nothing to justify their hatred nor gave them significant fodder - if the outcome is handled as above. We are better than them, we know it, and the world needs to see how we treat people who cross the line - even on the good guys' side.

Now as for it being torture, excepting for a small handful of instances (and not the ones that are getting the press and of which there are pictures) those acts weren't torture. Humiliation, nothing more. F.E.T.E.


"Yes, I believe the abuses were a severe setback for US rebuilding efforts in Iraq."

If you see that, then we're pretty much on the same page. For the record, I agree with you that perhaps some of the reporting on this story is overblown, particularly those stories that imply that there was some sort of military coverup. From everything I've read, it sounds that the U.S. did an admirable job of exposing this story on it's own.

On the other hand, this is a massive setback for our efforts in the region. It is not hyperbole to speculate that ultimately, American will die becuase of what these soldiers did.

Another point, the abuse appears to be far worse than some of my fellow war-supporters care to admit. While much of the abuse seems to have been of the "humiliation" variety, other abuse was much worse. One prisoner was apparently sodomized with a stick or other object. Another had a viscious sicced upon him. In another instance, a male U.S. solider "had sex with" a female prisoner (that's rape in my book).

Two other Iraqi prisoners were murdered, fer crissakes. So far, the only punishment handed out for one of the murders was a reduction in rank and a bad-conduct discharge for the murderer.

This is a bad story. My primary objection to joking about this isn't just that it's in bad taste (I post stuff that it's in arguable bad taste sometimes). My main objection is that it damages the credibility of those of us who support the war, and gives anti-war leftists a hard-to-rebut avenue of attacking us.

That said, it doesn't sound like you had any ill-intent with your post (nor did Charles), and I didn't infer any.

And Jimmy, have a nice day.


Hazing was the first thing that crossed my mind. It appears the type of humiliation our people perpetuated upon these no doubt worthy prisoners somehow occupies the same moral plane as kidnapping and actual torture.

If you're a reason-deprived Arab or a journalist, that is.

These punchbowl-floaters need to drop and give me twenty, the worms.

Saddam Hussein

For what it's worth, it didn't offend me either.


good gawd!!!! they were forced to wear womens underwear!! thier is some dark humor to be found in that!

and no one has proved to me that any of what the american soldiers did rose to the level of true torture, like feeding a man feet first into a shredder alla saddam.

fuckum if they cant take a joke.

Jimmy The Clam

Spoons got offended?


The Ugly American

So does this mean you're gonna stop? (sulks)


You were right on, no sorries needed or appropriate. Keep it up.


Didn't offend me either, pardner. Nothing offends me. I read Wonkette.

The Commissar

No, IH, you did not offend me. Taking a lighter view of dismal news is not such a bad idea. And your post was very funny.

But we shouldn't let a 'humorous take' persuade us that this was something akin to 'MPs just wanna have fun.'

Chyort! I HATE playing the high school principal.

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